Curse

EssayReader · Jun 19, 2010, 04:04 PM // 16:04

Oh the age old question which I have never received the answer to...

Also, please read through at least more than half of this before posting a reply.

I think we all know it, it's "Which is better, Tormentor's Insignia, or Survivor's Insignia?" Oh the dreadful question to which so much math is applied it hurts some of your brains, the rest of us we try out the math, the others...just play the game and attempt to find out by experience.

Radiant Head Armor of Superior X
Tormentor's Chest Armor of Superior Vigor
Survivor's Gloves of Attunement
Tormentor's Leggings of Attunement
Bloodstained Boots of Minor Soul Reaping

I play both PvE and PvP so I'm hoping you guys can help keep me with one ideal armor set. Here's my explanation for my armor:

Using just that, I have 460 health points, and 70 armor 5/8 of the time, which is more than half. The Survivor's on my gloves allows that 70 armor to also be helpful to still keeping some extra health, while at the same time helping whenever I don't get hit on my Chest or Legs.

Along with this, I have a +60 health point set, and we all know that shields give +8 armor (if you don't meet the requirement). Because of this, at times I have 460 health points and 78 armor in the best case scenario or 68 armor in the worst case scenario. With this information, I get 520 health points, and, let's say at the worst case scenario with +8 armor, the equivalent of 572 health points against non-armor ignoring damage, or in the best case scenario I have 637 health points, again, against non-armor ignoring damage.

Now, if I choose to only use a +30 health point shield, which gives the default +8 armor, and then I add a martial weapon with the Defense modification which adds +5 armor, I'm at +13 armor. This means, at 490 health, with the mentioned weapons, I would have 570 health points (rounded from 569.625), against non-armor ignorant damage in the worst case scenario. In the best case scenario I have 631 health points (rounded from 630.875) against non-armor ignorant damage.

Now, this is where I struggle to make a decision. With a +60 health point set, I would have 650 health points (this is the standard Survivor's Insignia and Vitae rune set-up) I would have 715 health points against non-armor ignorant damage. This PvP set-up tends to not use the +5 Defense modification upgrade, so I will leave that out.

Although this is more health points from a start, the problem lies in the fact that throughout a long battle, such as that in Heroes' Ascent, Alliance Battles, or Guild vs. Guilds, we run into constant damage. With the +armor from my current armor set, over a long period of time, it would sustain you longer against non-armor ignorant damage.

In addition, as a Necromancer we tend to sacrifice our health, and I would rather sacrifice at 460 health points, and then switch to a +60 health point set to replenish my health, somewhat.

Please help me decide if I should stick with Tormentor's Insignia, for PvE & PvP, or switch to Survivor's Insignia. Although many people disregard armor as nothing, Survivor's Insignia has me take more damage from non-armor ignorant damage, but helps me from degeneration and armor-ignoring damage.

However, I have noticed, when I am running Curses and I use Insidious Parasite, the armor (from Tormentor's and the other weapon sets) helps me to gain more health than I lose, which does not always tend to be the case with Insidious Parasite.

Think of this as the "official" Survivor's Insignia vs. Tormentor's Insignia thread so we can have a great discussion and help me choose. ^^

jonnieboi05 · Jun 19, 2010, 09:45 PM // 21:45

You're doing it so wrong...

How about you just buy another set of armor? Radiant has always and will always be shit when it comes to any form of gameplay besides some sort of farming that requires high high high energy.

No offense, but I LOVE when I meet people like you in PvP. You're so much easy(er) to kill. With such low health (even IF you use a shield set and a weapon with +armor) you're honestly begging to be swatted. :\

I would not recommend Tormentor's Insignias. There is a reason why it's only worth 100g (the BASE minimal price of any rune) at the trader when purchasing it.

Here are some example set ups of my armor (from top to bottom, left to right):

Warrior:
Survivor, Minor/Major Str
Sentinel's, Sup Absorption
Stonefist, Vigor
Sentinel's, Clarity
Survivor, Minor martial rune

Paragon:
Survivor, Minor Rune
Centurion's, Vigor
Survivor, Minor Rune
Centurion's, Clarity
Survivor, Vitae

Dervish:
Survivor, Minor rune
Windwalker's, Vigor
Survivor, Minor rune
Windwalker's, Clarity
Survivor, Vitae

Assassin:
Survivor, Minor/Major rune
Nightstalker's, Vigor
Survivor, Minor rune
Nightstalker's, Clarity
Survivor, Vitae

Ritualist:
Survivor, Minor/Sup rune (depending on if PvE or PvP)
Shaman's/Survivor (depending on if PvE or PvP), Vigor
Survivor, Minor/Major rune (depending on if PvE or PvP)
Shaman's/Survivor (depending on if PvE or PvP), Vitae
Survivor, Vitae

Necromancer:
Survivor, Minor/Sup rune (depending on if PvE or PvP)
Survivor, Vigor
Survivor, Minor rune
Survivor, Vitae
Bloodstained, Vitae

Monk:
Survivor, Minor heal/prot rune
Survivor, Vigor
Survivor, Minor divine
Survivor, Vitae
Survivor, Vitae

Elementalist:
Survivor, Minor/Sup rune (depending on if PvE or PvP)
Survivor, Vigor
Survivor, Minor e-storage
Survivor, Vitae
Survivor, Vitae

Ranger:
Survivor, Minor/Sup rune (depending on if PvE or PvP)
Survivor, Vigor
Survivor, Minor rune
Survivor, Vitae
Survivor, Vitae

Mesmer:
Survivor, Minor/Major (depending on if PvE or PvP)
Survivor, Vigor
Survivor, Minor rune
Survivor, Vitae
Survivor, Vitae

edit: In case you (the OP) or anyone else reading this is wondering why I put +armor insignias on the chest/legs, it's because those 2 locations are hit the most frequent; hence you get the most benefit from having +armor on your chest/legs rather than your head, arms and feet.

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 19, 2010, 10:46 PM // 22:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05

edit: In case you (the OP) or anyone else reading this is wondering why I put +armor insignias on the chest/legs, it's because those 2 locations are hit the most frequent; hence you get the most benefit from having +armor on your chest/legs rather than your head, arms and feet.

You know, you really shouldn't tell people 'you're doing it so wrong' when you have fail like this at the end of your post.

Yes, the +armor runes are more effective because you get hit 2 or 3 times as much, but thats why you get 2 or 3 times as much health or energy from Survivor and Radiant runes. All that matters is how much armor/health/energy you want. Having Brawlers on the feet, head, and arms (1/8 each) and Survivors on the chest and legs (5/8 total) is identical in every way to Brawlers on the chest and Survivor everywhere else.

The statement 'you get the most benefit from having +armor on your chest/legs rather than your head, arms and feet' is completely redundant because everything gains the most benefit (in an equal ratio to that of the head/hands/feet) from being on the chest/legs, barring globals.

EssayReader · Jun 19, 2010, 11:17 PM // 23:17

JonniBoi05:

Quote:

How about you just buy another set of armor? Radiant has always and will always be shit when it comes to any form of gameplay besides some sort of farming that requires high high high energy.

Uh...what was this meant for? Also, as previously stated above in my original first post, I'm trying for just one armor set right now.

Quote:

I would not recommend Tormentor's Insignias. There is a reason why it's only worth 100g (the BASE minimal price of any rune) at the trader when purchasing it.

It means not many people buy it, it doesn't mean it's completely useless.

Quote:

No offense, but I LOVE when I meet people like you in PvP. You're so much easy(er) to kill. With such low health (even IF you use a shield set and a weapon with +armor) you're honestly begging to be swatted. :\

I mentioned Insidious Parasite earlier, which gives me more health than I lose with +armor, in contrast with +health points. Easier.

Marty Silverblade:

Quote:

Yes, the +armor runes are more effective because you get hit 2 or 3 times as much, but thats why you get 2 or 3 times as much health or energy from Survivor and Radiant runes. All that matters is how much armor/health/energy you want. Having Brawlers on the feet, head, and arms (1/8 each) and Survivors on the chest and legs (5/8 total) is identical in every way to Brawlers on the chest and Survivor everywhere else.

Is there math for the +armor runes being more efficient than the +health point runes? I just feel like I need mathematical assurance here. Not saying you're wrong or anything.

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 19, 2010, 11:34 PM // 23:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by EssayReader

Is there math for the +armor runes being more efficient than the +health point runes? I just feel like I need mathematical assurance here. Not saying you're wrong or anything.

Health vs. Armor debates have been going on since the game came out. Armor is generally more useful than health. I'll dig around on Wiki and see what I can find.

EDIT: Here goes. Never any calculations like this before so I'm hoping I'm looking at the right formulas. Using this for reference: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/content...nics-id674.php

[Actualized Damage] = [Effective Damage] × [Defensive Adjustment]. To kill you, actualised damage would have to surpass your max health.

[Defensive Adjustment] = 2((60 - [Armor Level]) / 40)

Case 1: All health insignia. You have 550 health and 68 armor.

Actualised damage = 550
Defensive adjustment = 2^(-8/40) = 2^(-1/5) = 1.8

Thus 550 = EffDam x 1.8.
Thus EffDam = 305.6

305.6 damage would need to be dealt in order to kill you with this setup.

Case 2: All armor insignia. You have 515 health and 78 armor.

Actualised damage = 515
Defensive adjustment = 2^(-0.45) = 1.55

Thus 515 = EffDam x 1.55
Thus EffDam = 332.3

332.3 damage would need to be dealt in order to kill you with this setup.

-------------------

Conclusion: On the assumption that all damage you take is armor affected (so ruling out degen and armor ignoring effects) and that damage is not reduced by prots, spirits, or whatnot, +armor is better. This is just numbers of course, results will differ according to location and context.

Maver1ck87 · Jun 19, 2010, 11:35 PM // 23:35

Ok guys, Marty, i understand what your getting at but i'm really sorry but I must disagree. Ok, im going to broaden the question initially before focussing specifically on tormentors vs survivors...

Armour vs Health:

Its late so i'll be briefish...

Yes: Marty is right, proportionately they are similar on each piece of armour... however there is a difference, which I will highlight with 2 examples

1) Obsidian flame spike: Old dead build yes, but highlights a good point of armour ignoring dmg. If as a monk u were running full disciples insignias vs this, u would have 40hp less than someone running full survivor insignias... therefore it is obvious that health has an advantage in this case

2) GvG: MONKS ARE NOT GODS, THEY DO NOT HAVE INFINITE ENERGY, AND NO MATTER HOW GOOD THEY ARE WoH STILL HEALS FOR 94 + 109 at 14 healing prayers. So... taking this into account, unless u want your team to die, u must heal up all dmg taken by your team. Therefore if u have a bunch of necros using tormentors insignias they will take LESS dmg total than if they were running full survivors. HOWEVER, it would be similar in proportion to their maximum health... e.g. a necro with tormentors will take about damage equal to 50% of their maximum health from a warrior over 3 seconds, as will a necro with survivors take dmg equal to about 50% of their maximum health over the same 3 seconds. However in the second case MORE healing will need to be done to bring that character to full health.

Last thing criticals hit your head, and as it is spikes with 2 or more ciritcals that usually get kills in PvP you should ALWAYS have + armour rune on ur headpiece.

To summarise for PvP:
in HA run full survivors
in GvG/RA run Max armour

PvE:
Complicated due to the way monsters aggro in HM, related to max HP, current HP and armour... tbh it makes very little difference as PvE is pretty easy, if u know how to swap to a shield set that should be enough

Never run Superior runes in PvP unless ur name is polly and u have eviscerate

Any more questions? I will elaborate on anything you want but that should cover most of it...

Personnaly i run tormentors

Also, whoever the idiot who said tormentors were cheap and therefore not good thats the best joke ive heard all day

byteme! · Jun 20, 2010, 12:05 AM // 00:05

Quote:

I play both PvE and PvP

I will only mention the PvE side of this argument because it's the most obvious and non debatable. +Armor rules. With all the consumables (+HP, Dp removal etc..) and titles (Norn) floating around there's no reason not to max out your armor regardless which class you play. Also keep in mind especially in HM where monsters do a retarded amount of damage (even wanding) that the extra armor will come into play ALL THE TIME. Even when you think there's a lot of armor ignoring damage it all comes from the skills and when your enemy isn't using those skills they are auto attacking. +Armor for PvE hands down.

As for PvP, well this debate will go on forever. I still side with +Armor though.

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 20, 2010, 12:18 AM // 00:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maver1ck87

Ok guys, Marty, i understand what your getting at but i'm really sorry but I must disagree. Ok, im going to broaden the question initially before focussing specifically on tormentors vs survivors...

This wasn't my point. I was just pointing out the 'armor on chest and legs is best because they get hit more' logic is flawed and incorrect. Which is better in any given circumstance is debatable, as you've shown (leaving them in because they're good examples).

Quote:

1) Obsidian flame spike: Old dead build yes, but highlights a good point of armour ignoring dmg. If as a monk u were running full disciples insignias vs this, u would have 40hp less than someone running full survivor insignias... therefore it is obvious that health has an advantage in this case

2) GvG: MONKS ARE NOT GODS, THEY DO NOT HAVE INFINITE ENERGY, AND NO MATTER HOW GOOD THEY ARE WoH STILL HEALS FOR 94 + 109 at 14 healing prayers. So... taking this into account, unless u want your team to die, u must heal up all dmg taken by your team. Therefore if u have a bunch of necros using tormentors insignias they will take LESS dmg total than if they were running full survivors. HOWEVER, it would be similar in proportion to their maximum health... e.g. a necro with tormentors will take about damage equal to 50% of their maximum health from a warrior over 3 seconds, as will a necro with survivors take dmg equal to about 50% of their maximum health over the same 3 seconds. However in the second case MORE healing will need to be done to bring that character to full health.

----------------

Quote:

Last thing criticals hit your head, and as it is spikes with 2 or more ciritcals that usually get kills in PvP you should ALWAYS have + armour rune on ur headpiece.

Really? I've never heard this before. Unless you can provide a reliable source (non-official wiki doesn't mention it) that shows this, I'll call this nonsense.

jonnieboi05 · Jun 20, 2010, 12:44 AM // 00:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

You know, you really shouldn't tell people 'you're doing it so wrong' when you have fail like this at the end of your post.

Yes, the +armor runes are more effective because you get hit 2 or 3 times as much, but thats why you get 2 or 3 times as much health or energy from Survivor and Radiant runes. All that matters is how much armor/health/energy you want. Having Brawlers on the feet, head, and arms (1/8 each) and Survivors on the chest and legs (5/8 total) is identical in every way to Brawlers on the chest and Survivor everywhere else.

The statement 'you get the most benefit from having +armor on your chest/legs rather than your head, arms and feet' is completely redundant because everything gains the most benefit (in an equal ratio to that of the head/hands/feet) from being on the chest/legs, barring globals.

You must be trolling.

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 20, 2010, 12:54 AM // 00:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05

You must be trolling.[/b]

Believe it or not, you don't know everything, and you aren't always right. Your logic is flawed. If you want to (try to) prove me wrong, go ahead. I'm happy to debate it. Labelling people trolls because they see things differently just shows ignorance.

jonnieboi05 · Jun 20, 2010, 01:08 AM // 01:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

Believe it or not, you don't know everything, and you aren't always right. Your logic is flawed. If you want to (try to) prove me wrong, go ahead. I'm happy to debate it. Labelling people trolls because they see things differently just shows ignorance.

Sorry but the only ignorant thing posted so far in this thread was when you assumed I was indeed calling you a troll, which I was not.

I know I am not always right (but when I am wrong I will gracefully admit it since it is a rare thing to happen [yes. go ahead. call me an egomaniac now]). I do not deny that. However, I will still side with the fact that +AL on your chest and leggings is more effective than on the other 3 parts.

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 20, 2010, 01:18 AM // 01:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05

Sorry but the only ignorant thing posted so far in this thread was when you assumed I was indeed calling you a troll, which I was not.

My point was that when I disagreed you called me a troll rather than giving evidence to prove your point. Reading between the lines it seems like you're saying 'wtf, of course I'm right'. Anyway, enough of that,

Quote:

However, I will still side with the fact that +AL on your chest and leggings is more effective than on the other 3 parts.

I know. I agree. That wasn't my point. It is that saying +armor should be put on the chest and legs and survivor on the other pieces because the chest and legs gets hit more is nonsense. You're taking correct information; the interpretation is flawed.

Lets take the hands/feet/head as a baseline. On these pieces, you'll be protected (+armor counts) 1/8 of the time and survivor will grant an additional 5 health.

Lets now compare this to the legs. On these pieces, you'll be protected 2/8 of the time and survivor will grant an additional 10 health. Both insignia have double the effect from being placed on the legs. This is the key point that flaws your logic. If survivor was a fixed +health then you would be correct, but it isn't.

If you still disagree, think about this:

1) Why do survivor and radiant insignia give different bonuses based on location? If you cannot justify this, you are incorrect.

2) Apart from taking up more insignia slots, what is the difference between +armor on the chest only and +armor on the feet, hands, and legs together. If the answer is none, you are incorrect.

jonnieboi05 · Jun 20, 2010, 01:26 AM // 01:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

My point was that when I disagreed you called me a troll rather than giving evidence to prove your point. Reading between the lines it seems like you're saying 'wtf, of course I'm right'. Anyway, enough of that,

And I apologize for the misunderstanding and you're right, I should have specified more (I really didn't expect to type out more than that. I was/am busy catching my Pokemon so I was rushing. >___________<)

EssayReader · Jun 20, 2010, 01:43 AM // 01:43

Okay, so my final decision after these few posts is to stick with Tormentor's Insignia. However, the part that concerns me is the idea or fact of critical strikes always hitting the head.

If this is true, I do plan on changing my armor very slightly.

jonnieboi05 · Jun 20, 2010, 01:52 AM // 01:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by EssayReader

However, the part that concerns me is the idea or fact of critical strikes always hitting the head.

If this is true, I do plan on changing my armor very slightly.

This is literally something I have never heard of before today in this post.

As with Marty, I will also have to say it sounds bogus until proof/in-depth research is provided.

Xenomortis · Jun 20, 2010, 02:34 AM // 02:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by EssayReader

Radiant Head Armor of Superior X
Tormentor's Chest Armor of Superior Vigor
Survivor's Gloves of Attunement
Tormentor's Leggings of Attunement
Bloodstained Boots of Minor Soul Reaping

Radiant insignia are almost always a waste. Necromancers pretty much never need them (55 tanking perhaps?). The same applies to Runes of Attunement.
Bloodstained is really only applicable to Death Magic builds, Curses and Blood builds will very rarely take a long cast corpse exploitation skill and so it's advisable to put the Bloodstained insignia on the headpiece that has your Death Magic rune should you ever want to run an MM build.

Some things worth noting:
Full Survivor's adds 40 health - flat.
Full Tormentor's adds 10 armour - reducing all armour sensitive damage by around 16%. The caveat is that it will also increase holy damage taken by 16 - this is really only a threat when dealing with Ray of Judgement spam (not too common).
A superior vigor rune coupled with two vitae runes almost fully negates the loss from a Superior attribute rune - that leaves one slot free for your minor soul reaping rune. One Survivor insignia (say on the headpiece) will return you to 480.

The question now is: "is a 16% reduction vs armour sensitive damage better than a flat 8% increase in health".

Also note:
10 armour is always a 16% reduction in damage, regardless of what the rest of my equipment consists of.
If I have any fortitude mods on my weapons however, the increase from Survivor's as a percentage starts to decrease and become far less valuable.
But, with high Death Penalty, Survivor's becomes much more valuable.

The following are really my recommendations.

There is only one build where I would say "let your health drop below 500". The rest of the time, always aim to get at least 500 and certainly not below the base of 480. I will mention this build soon.

Get multiple armour sets. In order of priority; Survivor, Tormentor's, Minion Master's. Don't worry too much about getting loads of headsets though - it's not too bad sticking Survivor's on the lot of them (although Bloodstained on the Death one is valuable for minion builds).
I put Survivor's above Tormentor's simply because Survivor's is valuable as a buffer against Death Penalty and you really cannot go wrong with it. Very few Necromancer builds have sacrifice costs were 40 health is going to hurt. However I recommend wearing the Tormentor's over Survivor's.

I do not recommend mixing and matching. There's really no advantage to it; you either need the health from Survivor's or you don't.

The one build where I say you can safely let your health drop below 480 is an Order of Undeath MM build. The sacrifice costs are huge, you really want a Superior Rune and Minion Master's insignia is very nice for the job.
The rest of the time, if your health gets to 480 and you don't want to swap out of your 40/40 set, then it's time to switch to Survivor's.

In Hard Mode PvE, if you fall under heavy attack and no protection arrives; you're going to die no matter what you're wearing. I say that only to remind you that the ultimate choice isn't too important.
The same generally applies to PvP too, however instant death spikes are a little less common and you can see the Warrior coming before he unleashes.

jonnieboi05 · Jun 20, 2010, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Radiant insignia are almost always a waste. Necromancers pretty much never need them (55 tanking perhaps?). The same applies to Runes of Attunement.
Bloodstained is really only applicable to Death Magic builds, Curses and Blood builds will very rarely take a long cast corpse exploitation skill and so it's advisable to put the Bloodstained insignia on the headpiece that has your Death Magic rune should you ever want to run an MM build.

Some things worth noting:
Full Survivor's adds 40 health - flat.
Full Tormentor's adds 10 armour - reducing all armour sensitive damage by around 16%. The caveat is that it will also increase holy damage taken by 16 - this is really only a threat when dealing with Ray of Judgement spam (not too common).
A superior vigor rune coupled with two vitae runes almost fully negates the loss from a Superior attribute rune - that leaves one slot free for your minor soul reaping rune. One Survivor insignia (say on the headpiece) will return you to 480.

The question now is: "is a 16% reduction vs armour sensitive damage better than a flat 8% increase in health".

Also note:
10 armour is always a 16% reduction in damage, regardless of what the rest of my equipment consists of.
If I have any fortitude mods on my weapons however, the increase from Survivor's as a percentage starts to decrease and become far less valuable.
But, with high Death Penalty, Survivor's becomes much more valuable.

The following are really my recommendations.

There is only one build where I would say "let your health drop below 500". The rest of the time, always aim to get at least 500 and certainly not below the base of 480. I will mention this build soon.

Get multiple armour sets. In order of priority; Survivor, Tormentor's, Minion Master's. Don't worry too much about getting loads of headsets though - it's not too bad sticking Survivor's on the lot of them (although Bloodstained on the Death one is valuable for minion builds).
I put Survivor's above Tormentor's simply because Survivor's is valuable as a buffer against Death Penalty and you really cannot go wrong with it. Very few Necromancer builds have sacrifice costs were 40 health is going to hurt. However I recommend wearing the Tormentor's over Survivor's.

I do not recommend mixing and matching. There's really no advantage to it; you either need the health from Survivor's or you don't.

The one build where I say you can safely let your health drop below 480 is an Order of Undeath MM build. The sacrifice costs are huge, you really want a Superior Rune and Minion Master's insignia is very nice for the job.
The rest of the time, if your health gets to 480 and you don't want to swap out of your 40/40 set, then it's time to switch to Survivor's.

In Hard Mode PvE, if you fall under heavy attack and no protection arrives; you're going to die no matter what you're wearing. I say that only to remind you that the ultimate choice isn't too important.
The same generally applies to PvP too, however instant death spikes are a little less common and you can see the Warrior coming before he unleashes.

^Yes.

I agree 95%.

EssayReader · Jun 20, 2010, 03:49 AM // 03:49

Xenomortis:

Quote:

Bloodstained is really only applicable to Death Magic builds, Curses and Blood builds will very rarely take a long cast corpse exploitation skill and so it's advisable to put the Bloodstained insignia on the headpiece that has your Death Magic rune should you ever want to run an MM build.

As previously stated in my first post, I'm hoping for equipment that will last me for PvP and PvE.

Also, I looked up damages under the Wiki, and noted that overall, in the PvP metagame as well as just on the list of skills that are given to each class, there are more non-armor ignoring skills than there are armor-ignoring skills.

jonnieboi05 · Jun 20, 2010, 03:53 AM // 03:53

I still do not understand why you don't just get 1-2 extra sets of armor... The armor does not even have to be flashy! For ~7k you can get an entire new set of armor. For the runes /insignias you are only looking at an additional 10k.

So... What's the problem? >_<

EssayReader · Jun 20, 2010, 05:48 AM // 05:48

My indecisive ability to get more than one armor set...